演講MP3+雙語文稿:你的腸道的科學(xué)魅力令人驚訝

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[演講者及介紹]Giulia Enders

博士，作家朱利亞·恩德斯正在努力揭示我們的腸道是如何成為我們的核心的。

[演講主題]你的腸道的科學(xué)魅力令人驚訝

[中英文字幕]

翻譯者 Yan Chen 校對(duì)者 Yu Xie

00:13

A few years ago, I always had this thinghappening to me, especially at family gatherings like teas with aunts anduncles or something like this. When people come up to you, and they ask you,"So, what are you doing?" And I would have this magical one-wordreply, which would make everybody happy: "Medicine. I'm going to be adoctor." Very easy, that's it, everybody's happy and pleased. And it couldbe so easy, but this effect really only lasts for 30 seconds with me, becausethat's then the time when one of them would ask, "So, in what area ofmedicine? What specialty do you want to go into?" And then I would have tostrip down in all honesty and just say, "OK, so I'm fasted with thecolon. It all started with the anus, and now it's basically the whole intestinaltract."

幾年前，我總是會(huì)面臨這樣的場(chǎng)景，特別是在家庭聚會(huì)的時(shí)候，比如說跟叔叔阿姨們一起喝茶。他們走到你身邊，然后問你，“你最近在干嘛呢？”而我會(huì)用一個(gè)能使每個(gè)人都高興的充滿魔力的詞回答：“學(xué)醫(yī)。我將要成為一名醫(yī)生?！狈浅Ｈ菀?，每個(gè)人也都很高興。它要是這么容易就好了，但是這種效果對(duì)我來說只會(huì)持續(xù)30秒。因?yàn)橹笥械娜藭?huì)問，“那么，你想進(jìn)入哪個(gè)醫(yī)學(xué)領(lǐng)域？哪個(gè)專業(yè)呢？”然后我就會(huì)實(shí)話實(shí)說，“我很癡迷于結(jié)腸。一切都是從肛門開始的，現(xiàn)在基本上是整個(gè)腸道。”

01:06

（Laughter）

（笑聲）

01:08

And this would be the moment when theenthusiasm trickled, and it would maybe also get, like, awkwardly silent in theroom, and I would think this was terribly sad, because I do believe our bowelsare quite charming.

然后這一刻熱烈的氣氛冷了下來，可能房間里也變成了尷尬的沉默，而我覺得這是很令人難過的，因?yàn)槲蚁嘈盼覀兊膬?nèi)臟是很迷人的。

01:22

（Laughter）

（笑聲）

01:23

And while we're in a time where many peopleare thinking about what new superfood smoothie to make or if gluten is maybebad for them, actually, hardly anyone seems to care about the organ where thishappens, the concrete anatomy and the mechanisms behind it. And sometimes itseems to me like we're all trying to figure out this magic trick, but nobody'schecking out the magician, just because he has, like, an embarrassing hairstyleor something. And actually, there are reasons science disliked the gut for along time; I have to say this.

我們所處的時(shí)代，有很多人在考慮哪種超級(jí)食品容易消化，或者麩質(zhì)是否有損他們的健康，但事實(shí)上，很少有人去關(guān)心消化過程所發(fā)生的器官，以及它具體的解剖結(jié)構(gòu)和背后的機(jī)制。有時(shí)在我看來，我們都在試圖去揭秘魔術(shù)，但是沒有人檢查魔術(shù)師，可能僅僅因?yàn)樗?，比如說一個(gè)難看的發(fā)型或者什么的。而事實(shí)上，長(zhǎng)久以來，科學(xué)家都不怎么青睞腸道，我必須得說出來。

01:59

So, it's complex. There's a lot of surfacearea -- about 40 times the area of our skin. Then, in such a tight pipe, thereare so many immune cells that are being trained there. We have 100 trillion bacteriadoing all sorts of things -- producing little molecules. Then there's about 20different hormones, so we are on a very different level than our genitals, forexample. And the nervous system of our gut is so complex that when we cut out apiece, it's independent enough that when we poke it, it mumbles back at us,friendly.

因?yàn)樗珡?fù)雜了，它的表面積很大——是我們皮膚表面積的40倍。在這么一根緊密的管道里，有很多的免疫細(xì)胞在生長(zhǎng)發(fā)育，我們有一百萬億的細(xì)菌在里面從事各種活動(dòng)——產(chǎn)生小分子，然后大概還有20種不同的激素分子，舉例來說，腸道跟生殖器的復(fù)雜程度不在同一個(gè)層級(jí)上。我們腸道上的神經(jīng)系統(tǒng)也很復(fù)雜，如果我們切出一小塊，它能夠獨(dú)立到當(dāng)我們戳它的時(shí)候，對(duì)我們友好地咕噥一下。

02:29

（Laughter）

（笑聲）

02:32

But at least those reasons are also thereasons why it's so fasting and important.

但至少這些也是讓它如此迷人和重要的理由。

02:39

It took me three steps to love the gut. Sotoday, I invite you to follow me on those three steps. The very first was justlooking at it and asking questions like, "How does it work?" and"Why does it have to look so weird for that sometimes?" And it actuallywasn't me asking the first kind of these questions, but my roommate. After oneheavy night of partying, he came into our shared-room kitchen, and he said,"Giulia, you study medicine. How does pooping work?"

我用了三個(gè)步驟就愛上了腸道。所以今天，我邀請(qǐng)你們跟著我的這三步走。首先，就是看著它，并且提問，比如“它是如何工作的？”以及“為什么它有時(shí)看起來這么奇怪？”事實(shí)上，這類的問題不是我首先提出來的，而是我的室友。在一天晚上的派對(duì)過后，他來到我們共用的廚房，說，“朱莉婭，你是學(xué)醫(yī)的，你說說排便的工作原理是什么？”

03:13

（Laughter）

（笑聲）

03:15

And I did study medicine but I had no idea,so I had to go up to my room and look it up in different books. And I foundsomething interesting, I thought, at that time. So it turns out, we don't onlyhave this outer sphincter, we also have an inner sphincter muscle. The outersphincter we all know, we can control it, we know what's going on there; theinner one, we really don't. So what happens is, when there are leftovers fromdigestion, they're being delivered to the inner one first. This inner one willopen in a reflex and let through a little bit for testing.

我的確是學(xué)醫(yī)的，但這個(gè)我還真不知道，因此我回到自己的房間, 從不同的書上去找答案。然后我找到一些在當(dāng)時(shí)覺得很有趣的東西。結(jié)果是，我們不僅有外括約肌，我們還有內(nèi)括約肌。我們都知道外括約肌，我們能控制它，我們知道那里發(fā)生了什么，而內(nèi)括約肌，我們就不怎么了解了。所以事情是這樣的，當(dāng)有消化后的殘?jiān)a(chǎn)生時(shí)，它們首先會(huì)被送到內(nèi)括約肌，內(nèi)括約肌會(huì)在反射作用下打開，然后測(cè)試性地讓它們一點(diǎn)點(diǎn)地通過。

03:46

（Laughter）

（笑聲）

03:48

So, there are sensory cells that willanalyze what has been delivered: Is it gaseous or is it solid? And they willthen send this information up to our brain, and this is the moment when ourbrain knows, "Oh, I have to go to the toilet."

這里有感覺細(xì)胞，會(huì)分析送過來的是什么：是氣體還是固體？然后它們會(huì)向大腦反饋信息，我們的大腦就會(huì)知道“哦，我要去上廁所了?！?/p>

04:03

（Laughter）

（笑聲）

04:06

The brain will then do what it's designedto do with its amazing consciousness. It will mediate with our surroundings,and it will say something like, "So, I checked. We are at this TEDxconference -- "

然后大腦會(huì)用它神奇的意識(shí)去完成它的本職工作。它會(huì)結(jié)合我們周圍的環(huán)境進(jìn)行調(diào)和，它可能會(huì)這樣說，“我已經(jīng)檢查過了，我們正在TEDx大會(huì)上——“

04:18

（Laughter）

（笑聲）

04:23

（Applause）

（掌聲）

04:25

Gaseous? Maybe, if you're sitting on thesides, and you know you can pull it off silently.

肚子里有氣體？也許，如果你坐在靠邊的位置，你知道你可以默默地放掉它。

04:32

（Laughter）

（笑聲）

04:34

But solid -- maybe later.

但是肚子里有固體——可能要等會(huì)兒。

04:36

（Laughter） Since our outer sphincter andthe brain is connected with nervous cells, they coordinate, cooperate, and theyput it back in a waiting line --

（笑聲）由于我們的外括約肌跟大腦是由神經(jīng)細(xì)胞連接在一起的，它們互相協(xié)調(diào)、合作，于是就會(huì)把殘?jiān)呕氐降群蚓€。

04:47

（Laughter）

（笑聲）

04:50

for other times, like, for example, whenwe're at home sitting on the couch, we have nothing better to do, we are freeto go.

其它的時(shí)候，比如說，當(dāng)我們?cè)诩依镒谏嘲l(fā)上時(shí)，我們沒有其它更要緊的事去做，我們可以自由地去洗手間。

04:57

（Laughter）

（笑聲）

05:01

Us humans are actually one of the very fewanimals that do this in such an advanced and clean way. To be honest, I hadsome newfound respect for that nice, inner sphincter dude -- not connected tonerves that care too much about the outer world or the time -- just caringabout me for once. I thought that was nice. And I used to not be a great fan ofpublic restrooms, but now I can go anywhere, because I consider it more whenthat inner muscle puts a suggestion on my daily agenda.

我們?nèi)祟愂呛苌俚膸追N用這種先進(jìn)的、干凈的方式排便的動(dòng)物之一。說實(shí)話，我有過一些出于對(duì)這個(gè)友好的內(nèi)括約肌兄弟的新發(fā)現(xiàn)——沒有跟那些太過關(guān)注外部世界 和時(shí)間的神經(jīng)相連—— 就僅僅關(guān)心我本身。我想這一點(diǎn)很好。我曾經(jīng)不習(xí)慣使用公共廁所，但是現(xiàn)在我去哪里都行了，因?yàn)槲椰F(xiàn)在考慮更多的是內(nèi)括約肌為我的日程安排提供的建議。

05:34

（Laughter）

（笑聲）

05:36

And also I learned something else, whichwas: looking closely at something I might have shied away from -- maybe theweirdest part of myself -- left me feeling more fearless, and also appreciatingmyself more. And I think this happens a lot of times when you look at the gut,actually. Like those funny rumbling noises that happen when you're in a groupof friends or at the office conference table, going, like, "Merrr,merrr..." This is not because we're hungry. This is because our smallintestine is actually a huge neat freak, and it takes the time in betweendigestion to clean everything up, resulting in those eight meters of gut --really, seven of them -- being very clean and hardly smelling like anything. Itwill, to achieve this, create a strong muscular wave that moves everythingforward that's been leftover after digestion. This can sometimes create asound, but doesn't necessarily have to always. So what we're embarrassed of isreally a sign of something keeping our insides fine and tidy.

我還學(xué)到了一些東西，即：密切關(guān)注那些我曾經(jīng)回避的東西——也許是我自己身上最奇怪的部分——讓我感到更加的無畏，并且更加的欣賞自己了。我認(rèn)為這發(fā)生在很多時(shí)候，尤其是當(dāng)你看著腸道的時(shí)候，它們時(shí)常發(fā)出的可笑的隆隆聲，當(dāng)你和一群朋友在一起或者在辦公室會(huì)議桌上，會(huì)發(fā)出類似“Merrr,merrr...."的聲音。這并不是因?yàn)槲覀凁I了。這是因?yàn)槲覀兊男∧c是一個(gè)巨大但靈巧的怪物，它花費(fèi)時(shí)間在消化道上將所有的東西清理干凈，使得那些8米長(zhǎng)的腸道，事實(shí)上是其中的7米左右，變得十分干凈，而且很難聞到任何味道。它為了實(shí)現(xiàn)這一點(diǎn)，就創(chuàng)造出了一個(gè)強(qiáng)大的肌肉收縮，從而推動(dòng)著未消化完的殘余物前進(jìn)。這么做有時(shí)就會(huì)產(chǎn)生一種聲音，但是并不是總是都這樣。所以，讓我們感覺尷尬的其實(shí)是一個(gè)信號(hào)，表明我們身體內(nèi)部正在保持和諧干凈。

06:41

Or this weird, crooked shape of our stomach-- a bit Quasimodo-ish. This actually makes us be able to put pressure on ourbelly without vomiting, like when we're laughing and when we're doing sports,because the pressure will go up and not so much sideways. This also createsthis air bubble that's usually always very visible in X-rays, for example, andcan sometimes, with some people, when it gets too big, create discomfort oreven some sensations of pain. But for most of the people, is just results thatit's far easier to burp when you're laying on your left side instead of yourright.

我們的胃甚至還會(huì)變形扭曲，看起來很不舒服。這樣的舉動(dòng)事實(shí)上使我們能夠?qū)毫Χ逊e到腹部，不需要通過嘔吐的方式，就像當(dāng)我們笑的時(shí)候，當(dāng)我們運(yùn)動(dòng)的時(shí)候，因?yàn)檫@些壓力會(huì)上升，而不會(huì)堆積到一旁。這種方式也產(chǎn)生了氣泡，在X光線中能夠清楚地看到，而且有時(shí)，對(duì)于一些人來說，當(dāng)氣泡變得太大，會(huì)產(chǎn)生不適感，甚至一些隱隱的疼痛。但是對(duì)于大多數(shù)人來說，結(jié)果只是相對(duì)于向右側(cè)，當(dāng)你向左側(cè)躺會(huì)更容易打嗝。

07:18

And soon I moved a bit further and startedto look at the whole picture of our body and health. This was actually after Ihad heard that someone I knew a little bit had killed himself. It happened thatI had been sitting next to that person the day before, and I smelled that hehad very bad breath. And when I learned of the suicide the next day, I thought:Could the gut have something to do with it? And I frantically started searchingif there were scientific papers on the connection of gut and brain. And to mysurprise, I found many.

不久，我又進(jìn)行了更加深入的研究，我開始觀察我們的身體整體的健康狀況。事實(shí)上，這是我在聽說某個(gè)我不是很熟的人自殺之后，而那個(gè)人前一天正坐在我旁邊，我聞見他有很嚴(yán)重的口臭。當(dāng)我第二天知道這個(gè)自殺事件時(shí)，我不禁想：腸道問題是不是跟自殺有關(guān)？于是我開始瘋狂搜尋是否有科學(xué)論文 研究了腸道和大腦的聯(lián)系。出乎意料的是，我找到了很多。

07:51

It turns out it's maybe not as simple as wesometimes think. We tend to think our brain makes these commands and then sendsthem down to the other organs, and they all have to listen. But really, it'smore that 10 percent of the nerves that connect brain and gut deliverinformation from the brain to the gut. We know this, for example, in stressfulsituations, when there are transmitters from the brain that are being sensed byour gut, so the gut will try to lower all the work, and not be working andtaking away blood and energy to save energy for problem-solving. This can go asfar as nervous vomiting or nervous diarrhea to get rid of food that it thendoesn't want to digest.

研究顯示，事實(shí)遠(yuǎn)比我們想的要復(fù)雜得多。我們過去認(rèn)為，是大腦做出那些指令，然后那些指令下傳到其他器官，所有器官都需要聽從。但是事實(shí)上，超過10%的連接著大腦和腸道的神經(jīng)把信息從大腦傳遞到腸道。正如我們所知道的，比如，在壓力的環(huán)境下，我們的腸道感知到大腦發(fā)出的信息。于是它放緩所有的功能，或者暫停工作，暫停血液和能量的供應(yīng)，以便保存能量來解決問題。它能夠運(yùn)行直到由于緊張性嘔吐或者腹瀉而擺脫它們不想去消化的食物。

08:34

Maybe more interestingly, 90 percent of thenervous fibers that connect gut and brain deliver information from our gut toour brain. And when you think about it a little bit, it does make sense, becauseour brain is very isolated. It's in this bony skull surrounded by a thick skin,and it needs information to put together a feeling of "How am I, as awhole body, doing?" And the gut, actually, is possibly the most importantadvisor for the brain because it's our largest sensory organ, collectinginformation not only on the quality of our nutrients, but really also on howare so many of our immune cells doing, or things like the hormones in our bloodthat it can sense. And it can package this information, and send it up to thebrain. It can, there, not reach areas like visual cortex or word formations --otherwise, when we digest, we would see funny colors or we would make funnynoises -- no. But it can reach areas for things like morality, fear or emotionalprocessing or areas for self-awareness.

或許更有趣的是，90%連接腸道和大腦的神經(jīng)纖維將腸道的信息傳遞到大腦，仔細(xì)想一想，這也說得通，因?yàn)槲覀兊拇竽X是非常獨(dú)立的。它在頭蓋骨中被薄膜包裹，它需要匯總信息來檢查自身的情況，比如”我的整個(gè)身體在干什么？“而腸道事實(shí)上是大腦最重要的建議者因?yàn)樗俏覀兩眢w中最大的感覺器官不僅收集我們營(yíng)養(yǎng)物的質(zhì)量信息還有收集免疫細(xì)胞的信息或者就像它能夠感知到的我們血液中的激素情況于是它打包這些信息，然后把它們傳到大腦這種傳輸不需要到達(dá)視覺皮層或者語言區(qū)域，否則，當(dāng)我們消化時(shí)，我們會(huì)看見搞笑的顏色或者會(huì)發(fā)出搞笑的聲音——不。但是它能到達(dá)類似道德判斷，害怕或者情緒處理的區(qū)域，或者自我意識(shí)區(qū)域。

09:39

So it does make sense that when our bodyand our brain are putting together this feeling of, "How am I, as a wholebody, doing?" that the gut has something to contribute to this process.And it also makes sense that people who have conditions like irritable bowelsyndrome or inflammatory bowel disease have a higher risk of having anxiety ordepression. I think this is good information to share, because many people willthink, "I have this gut thing, and maybe I also have this mental healththing." And maybe -- because science is not clear on that right now --it's really just that the brain is feeling sympathy with their gut.

所以，它確實(shí)起了很大的作用，當(dāng)我們的身體和我們的大腦將這種感覺整合在一起，即”整個(gè)身體在干什么？“時(shí)，腸道在這個(gè)過程中起到了一定的作用。這個(gè)說法也確實(shí)言之有理，那些患有腸易激綜合征的人或者患有炎性腸病的人，更容易得焦慮癥和抑郁癥。我認(rèn)為這是值得分享的信息，因?yàn)楹芏嗳硕紩?huì)認(rèn)為”我腸道有問題，那可能我也有精神健康問題?！翱赡?，因?yàn)樵谶@個(gè)領(lǐng)域科學(xué)家們尚未研究得很清楚——也許僅僅是大腦正在慰問腸道。

10:17

This has yet to grow in evidence until itcan come to practice. But just knowing about these kinds of research that's outthere at the moment helps me in my daily life. And it makes me thinkdifferently of my moods and not externalize so much all the time. I feeloftentimes during the day we are a brain and a screen, and we will tend to lookfor answers right there and maybe the work is stupid or our neighbor -- butreally, moods can also come from within. And just knowing this helped me, forexample, when I sometimes wake up too early, and I start to worry and wanderaround with my thoughts. Then I think, "Stop. What did I eat yesterday?Did I stress myself out too much? Did I eat too late or something?" Andthen maybe get up and make myself a tea, something light to digest. And assimple as that sounds, I think it's been surprisingly good for me.

在能夠用于實(shí)踐之前，這僅僅是一種跡象。但是單單是了解這些研究，在那一刻為我的日常生活提供了許多幫助。它讓我以不同的角度去認(rèn)識(shí)情緒，也讓我不再那么頻繁地外化自己的情緒。我時(shí)常感覺到在一天的生活中，我們就是一個(gè)大腦或屏幕，我們?cè)噲D尋找在眼前的答案，可能我們的工作很愚蠢或者我們鄰居——但是，情緒也會(huì)來自于內(nèi)部。了解這些確實(shí)幫助了我，舉個(gè)例子，當(dāng)我有時(shí)過早起床，我開始擔(dān)心并且開始神游，。然后我想：”停下來，我昨天吃了什么？我是不是過度勞累了？我是不是吃得太晚了或者別的什么？“然后可能就起床給自己倒一杯茶，一些易于消化的食物。這些想法聽起來很簡(jiǎn)單，但我認(rèn)為對(duì)我來說效果顯著。

11:10

Step three took me further away from ourbody, and to really understanding bacteria differently. The research we havetoday is creating a new definition of what real cleanliness is. And it's notthe hygiene hypothesis -- I think many maybe know this. So it states that whenyou have too little microbes in your environment because you clean all thetime, that's not really a good thing, because people get more allergies orautoimmune diseases then. So I knew this hypothesis, and I thought I wouldn'tlearn so much from looking at cleanliness in the gut. But I was wrong.

第三步讓我更深入地了解了我的身體，真正地改變了對(duì)細(xì)菌的理解。如今的研究創(chuàng)造了一個(gè)新的定義，關(guān)于真正的清潔是什么。它不是衛(wèi)生假說——我知道很多人可能了解這個(gè)。它說的是，當(dāng)你處于一個(gè)無菌環(huán)境中時(shí)，由于你總是很愛干凈，那并不是一件很好的事情，因?yàn)檫@樣會(huì)使人們得上更多的過敏癥或者自身免疫疾病。所以我知道這個(gè)假設(shè)后，我認(rèn)為自己觀察腸道清潔時(shí)，不會(huì)有什么收獲。但是我錯(cuò)了。

11:49

It turns out, real cleanliness is not aboutkilling off bacteria right away. Real cleanliness is a bit different. When welook at the facts, 95 percent of all bacteria on this planet don't harm us --they can't, they don't have the genes to do so. Many, actually, help us a lot,and scientists at the moment are looking into things like: Do some bacteriahelp us clean the gut? Do they help us digest? Do they make us put on weight orhave a lean figure although we're eating lots? Are others making us feel morecourageous or even more resilient to stress? So you see, there are morequestions when it comes to cleanliness. And, actually, the thing is, it's abouta healthy balance, I think. You can't avoid the bad all the time. This issimply not possible; there's always something bad around. So what really thewhole deal is when you look at a clean gut, it's about having good bacteria,enough of them, and then some bad. Our immune system needs the bad, too, so itknows what it's looking out for.

結(jié)果表明，真正的清潔并不是立馬消除細(xì)菌。真正的清潔是不同的。當(dāng)我們看到事實(shí)，在這個(gè)星球的95%的細(xì)菌并不會(huì)傷害我們——它們沒有相應(yīng)的基因去做這些事。事實(shí)上，其中很多細(xì)菌還會(huì)幫助我們，科學(xué)家在這個(gè)時(shí)候開始調(diào)查類似于：”一些細(xì)菌能否幫助我們清理腸道？“”它們能否幫助我們消化？“”它們能否幫助我們?cè)鲋鼗虮３志€條，即使我們吃了很多？“”其他細(xì)菌能否讓我們變得更加勇敢，或者甚至適應(yīng)壓力？“所以你看，當(dāng)涉及到清潔時(shí)，有太多的問題會(huì)產(chǎn)生。事實(shí)上，我認(rèn)為真相就是保持一個(gè)健康的平衡。你不能一直避免不好的事物，這幾乎是不可能的，我們身邊總是會(huì)有不好的東西。所以真正統(tǒng)籌全局的處理就是，當(dāng)你觀察干凈的腸道時(shí)，有足夠的有益細(xì)菌，也有一些不好的細(xì)菌。我們的免疫系統(tǒng)也需要不好的細(xì)菌，這樣它就知道該留心什么。

12:54

So I started having this differentperspective on cleanliness and a few weeks later, I held a talk at myuniversity, and I made a mistake by 1,000. And I went home and I realized inthat moment, I was like, "Ah! I made a mistake by 1,000. Oh God, that's somuch, and that's so embarrassing." And I started to think about this, Iwas like, "Ugh!" And after a while I said, "OK, I made this onemistake, but then I also told so many good and right and helpful things, so Ithink it's OK, you know? It's a clean thing." And then I was like,"Oh, wait. Maybe I took my perspective on cleanliness further." Andit's my theory at the moment that maybe we all do. Take it a bit further thanjust cleaning our living room, where maybe we make it to sort like a lifehygiene. Knowing that this is about fostering the good just as much as tryingto shelter yourself from the bad had a very calming effect on me.

所以我開始有了一個(gè)不同的關(guān)于干凈的觀點(diǎn)，在幾周之后，我在大學(xué)做了一次演講，我在1000位聽眾前犯了個(gè)錯(cuò)誤。當(dāng)我回到家，我意識(shí)到了這個(gè)錯(cuò)誤，不禁想：”??！我在1000人面前犯了錯(cuò)。我的天，這么多人，太尷尬了。”我不停地懊悔和感嘆，過了一會(huì)兒我說，”好吧，我的確犯了一個(gè)錯(cuò)誤，但是我也說了很多正確的，有幫助的東西，應(yīng)該沒關(guān)系的，是可以接受的?！比缓笪矣窒搿芭叮纫幌?。也許我關(guān)于干凈的理論更升華了?！边@就是我當(dāng)時(shí)的理論。將這個(gè)概念帶入到比打掃房間更廣大的領(lǐng)域，可能就是一次生命的衛(wèi)生。了解到這是在培育一種善，就像你盡量避開糟糕的事一樣，就會(huì)讓我平靜下來。

13:49

So in that sense, I hope today I told youmostly good and helpful things, and thank you for your time, for listening tome.

從這層意義上說，我希望今天我告訴了你們很多有幫助的東西，也很感謝你們能夠抽出時(shí)間來聽我的演講。

13:57

（Applause）

（掌聲）